Tool roundup · From Episode 004

n8n vs Claude Code vs Hermes: Which One Should You Use?

Three categories, one rule each. Scheduled work, visual work, and going in to get work done.

By Alec Saluga, with Justin Novak · Updated Jul 2026

The short answer

The split is by job, not by quality. Use n8n when you need to see and debug a workflow visually, or to wire two tools together fast. Use an always-on agent like Hermes or OpenClaw for anything on a schedule. Use Claude Code or Codex when you are going in to get work done.

Key takeaways

Alec Saluga's rule: if it's doing something all the time, use Hermes or OpenClaw. If you're going in to get work done, use Claude Code.
n8n's advantage is visibility. Claude Code agents are a black box where you verify outputs; in n8n you see every execution and find exactly what broke.
n8n is open source and self-hostable for about $4 a month with unlimited executions. Zapier and Make.com do fundamentally the same thing but bill per execution.
If you have never built a workflow, start in n8n. It teaches you what a system prompt is and how an HTTP request works, then switch to Claude Code once you have a feel.
Justin Novak's split: Hermes for high-velocity marketing operations, Claude Code as the daily driver, and a structured CRM for customer relationships.

When should you use n8n vs Claude Code vs Hermes?

This question gets answered badly because people argue about which tool is better. They do different jobs, and the operators who use all of them daily split by job rather than by preference.

Alec Saluga and Justin Novak went through the whole stack live on Episode 004. Their rules agree, which is the useful part.

“So if it's doing something all the time, use Hermes or OpenClaw. If you're going in to get work done, use Claude Code.”
Alec Saluga · 54:00

Why would you use n8n when Claude Code can just build it?

Because you can see it. That is the entire argument, and it is a better one than it sounds.

A coding agent is a black box: you state the outcome and then verify whether it worked. When it breaks, you are debugging by inference. In n8n every execution is visible, so you find exactly what is not functioning and why.

Alec is candid that n8n was more necessary a year and a half ago, before you could build the same logic in Claude Code or Codex. It survives because visibility is worth something, and because wiring two tools together does not need an agent.

“everyone's talking about Claude Code agents, and it's a black box. You tell it the outputs and verify if it's working. In n8n you see all the executions, find exactly what isn't functioning and why.”
Alec Saluga · 27:00

What does each one actually cost?

The pricing split matters more than it looks. Zapier and Make.com do fundamentally the same thing as n8n and are genuinely good, but they bill per execution, so a workflow that fires constantly gets expensive by design.

n8n is open source. Host it yourself for roughly $4 a month and run unlimited executions. If you have a high-frequency workflow, that is the whole decision.

Tool	Billing model
n8n (self-hosted)	Open source, about $4/month on your own infrastructure, unlimited executions
Zapier / Make.com	Billed per execution
Claude Code	Included with Claude paid plans
Codex	Needs a $20 OpenAI subscription

Which should you learn first?

n8n, if you have never built a workflow and do not consider yourself technical. This was Alec's answer to a live question about exactly this, and his reasoning is about education rather than capability.

You will learn what a system prompt is and how to make an HTTP request, because n8n makes you see both. Then, once you have a feel for how workflows actually operate, switch to Claude Code for anything complex.

His honest caveat: it is case by case and depends on your experience. In real time, anything complex goes to Claude Code. If he just needs to wire some tools together quickly, n8n all day.

Visual workflow builders: when you need to see it

n8n

Visual, connects tools, builds workflows, and lets you put AI inside the workflow. Its real advantage is that every execution is visible, so debugging is looking rather than guessing. Alec's most common use is routing data from a new landing page to a client, a Google Sheet, or Airtable. Simple, quick routing, all day.

Open source; about $4/month self-hosted, unlimited executions.
Zapier

Does fundamentally the same job as n8n and does it well, with a huge library of off-the-shelf integrations. The difference is billing: per execution. That is fine for low-frequency workflows and expensive for constant ones. Make.com sits in the same category with the same trade-off.

Free tier; billed per task volume.

Always-on agents: when it runs on a schedule

Hermes

Justin's pick for anything scheduled and for high-velocity marketing operations and intel. Anything he was doing manually in marketing ops gets offloaded here so colleagues are not doing busy work. Its edge is persistent memory: it does not forget you between sessions.

Free and paid model options; you supply the models.
OpenClaw

The other half of Alec's scheduled-work answer, and the one the AI4NTP operators run for always-on agents doing real work. If the job is a cron job, this or Hermes is the category, not a coding agent.

Open source; self-hosted.

Coding agents: when you are going in to get work done

Claude Code

The daily driver, where you have your environment and API keys already set. Reach for it when the work is complex, or when you are sitting down to build rather than to schedule. The cost is visibility: it is a black box, and you verify outcomes rather than watch steps.

Paid; included with Claude paid plans.
Codex

OpenAI's equivalent, and in Alec's words better in some cases and lightning fast. Same category and same rule as Claude Code: it is for going in and getting work done, including work that has nothing to do with shipping software, like building a deck or a PDF.

Needs a $20 OpenAI subscription.

Frequently asked questions

When should you use n8n vs Claude Code?

Alec Saluga's rule: if it's doing something all the time, use Hermes or OpenClaw; if you're going in to get work done, use Claude Code. n8n sits alongside both, for when you want to see and debug a workflow visually or wire two tools together quickly. Anything complex goes to Claude Code.

Is n8n still worth learning now that Claude Code exists?

Yes, for two reasons. If you have never built a workflow, n8n teaches you what a system prompt is and how an HTTP request works, because it makes you see both. And when something breaks, n8n shows every execution so you find exactly what failed, where a coding agent is a black box you verify by output.

n8n vs Zapier: what is the difference?

They do fundamentally the same thing and Zapier is genuinely good. The difference is billing. Zapier and Make.com charge per execution; n8n is open source and self-hostable for about $4 a month with unlimited executions. For a high-frequency workflow, that is the entire decision.

What is Hermes used for?

Scheduled and always-on work. Justin Novak uses it for high-velocity marketing operations and intel, offloading anything he was doing manually. Its distinguishing feature is persistent memory: unlike a chat window, it does not forget you when you close the tab.

Which should a non-technical person start with?

n8n. That was Alec's answer to this exact question live: for anyone who has never built these workflows or is not technical, it is a great starting point for understanding how they work. Once you have the feel, move to Claude Code for the complex builds.

Tools used in this post

Every tool here has its own page with pricing, who used it live, and honest alternatives.

n8n Claude Code Hermes OpenClaw Codex Zapier Apify GoHighLevel

Where this came from

Episode 004 · Recorded live

7 AI tools you've never heard of.

Watch the recap →YouTube replay →

22:00 Alecn8n. Great tool because it's visual, it lets you connect tools, build workflows, and put AI in the workflow.

25:00 AlecA lot of people use Zapier or Make.com, which are great and do fundamentally the same thing, but they're billed per execution. n8n is open source, host it on your own infrastructure for about $4 a month, unlimited executions.

26:00 AlecThe most common case is a new landing page where I need to pull the data in and route it to the client, or push it to a Google Sheet and Airtable. Simple, quick routing, I'll use n8n all day.

26:00 JustinSounds like it gives better control over the data and how to manipulate it, whereas AI can feel like a black box.

27:00 Aleceveryone's talking about Claude Code agents, and it's a black box. You tell it the outputs and verify if it's working. In n8n you see all the executions, find exactly what isn't functioning and why.

49:00 AlecFor anyone who's never built these workflows or isn't technical, n8n is a great starting point to understand how they work. What's a system prompt? How do you make an HTTP request? You'll learn that in n8n.

53:00 JustinHermes I use for high-velocity marketing operations and intel... And Claude Code is still my daily driver.

53:00 AlecMy take: anything you're running a cron job on, anything scheduled, I'd use Hermes or OpenClaw. Claude Code is the daily driver where you have your environment and API keys set

54:00 AlecSo if it's doing something all the time, use Hermes or OpenClaw. If you're going in to get work done, use Claude Code.

Who wrote this

Every AI4NTP post is written by an operator who was in the room when the work happened.

Alec Saluga LinkedIn →

Partner at AI4NTP

A former B2B salesman with no technical background who self-taught AI. He builds and deploys AI-driven marketing and websites, and has grown a following of over 15,000 teaching AI adoption.

Justin Novak LinkedIn →

Partner at AI4NTP

Founder and host of AI4NTP. He sold his first company from his college dorm room, and as a fractional CMO has helped scale multiple businesses past $50M in ARR.

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Last updated 2026-07-15